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Karen the Family Therapist Is Back
Welcome to the necessary conversation. I'm Chad Kultgen. With me today is my sister Haley Popeil, Lefty, my parents Bob and Mary Lou, and a very special guest uh Karen, aka Happy Mom and Grandma on Instagram and TikTok. We have had her here once before. As I ...
... ut" he said, "I thought I'd never meet you. And he was like in awe of us. I was like, this is crazy town. This is crazy. I shook his hand. I said, thank you. That's what Haley told me to do. You know. Yeah, did he like want a picture and your autograph? He probably did, but I was like, we need to leave. A little uncomfortable, a little uncomfo ...
... ike humanity's demise, my own demise, the demise of entire populations, things of that nature. I I do feel this though, within the last year on the podcast, both you and Haley have gotten more you're more grumpy, you're more quick to react and say things, and a little bit more mean maybe some days. I'm like, "Hey, I don't want to go here, but ...
... on't listen and they don't hear us. They just wait for their turn to talk. So, let me let me let me see what I can do here with that. Let me see what we can do here. So, Haley was talking about her fear for her son and his friends. And specifically about what's happening in Kansas with the trans people. Um people are much more likely to hear w ...
... le are much more likely to hear what you have to say if you first acknowledge what they say. Right? So, when I say that you kind of changed the subject, it was it was um Haley will hear you a lot better if you're able to say, "Yeah, I hear you. I understand how that's you know." >> the one who changed the subject. What's that? Haley is the one ...
... it was um Haley will hear you a lot better if you're able to say, "Yeah, I hear you. I understand how that's you know." >> the one who changed the subject. What's that? Haley is the one who changed the subject, not me. She went I was talking about the Chinese trying to feed their own people, and she went straight into some tran- transgender r ...
... he I was trying to express why we're grumpier on the show, and you don't listen to me and you don't hear me. You just want to spout your [ __ ] about China. I heard you, Haley, but I think we all are in hard times having to navigate everything that we're being bombarded with on TV, on the internet. It's hard. We're not I'm not coping that well ...
... t. I don't. I know, and I I am disagreeing with you on that. But I also I want to ask you about this. You said we are not in the same group of people referring to me and Haley and you and Mom, but we literally are. It's our family. That group of people, we are all four in it. We are in the same group of people. >> get on board with our side of ...
... n it. We are in the same group of people. >> get on board with our side of the fence. Oh my gosh. Is that what you want, Bob? Yeah. You want them to and they and Bob and Haley, you guys want mom and dad to get on your side of the fence, fair? Yes. That's what they want. >> Yeah. Mary Lou, where are you on this? Do you want I feel >> I feel lik ...
... the middle and try to hold us all together all the time and it gets too hard. It gets way too hard. You get exhausted, huh? Yes. Yeah, I can see that. Yeah. Yeah. Um So Haley says something, Bob says something, Chad says something. Does any of you feel like other people in the family listen to what you had to say in that couple minutes there? ...
... like you and Chad are pretty respectful about listening to each other and hearing each other's point of view on those midweek? I think so. Yes, I do. Yeah. Okay. >> And Haley used to be in them two midweek, but now she's too busy. >> [laughter] >> I mean I mean not meaning that was rude, but she's real busy with her job and I understand that. ...
... capitalist instead of a communist. Okay, we're not doing politics, please. She owns a bakery, you know this and she's busy baking. Baking biscuits. And selling t-shirts. Haley, do you play poker? >> [laughter] >> No. You have a good You have a good poker face. Yeah, I don't know You know, I don't know. >> [laughter] >> I've been I've been deal ...
... >> [laughter] >> Nevertheless, >> so exciting. we were hanging out, you know, yeah. We were doing [ __ ] together. >> One of those old pictures that I sent you, Chad and Haley, it was Dad and Haley standing with their trophies together. Yeah, that was a [clears throat] funny ass picture. >> Yeah, like yeah, he was heavily involved in our sport ...
... theless, >> so exciting. we were hanging out, you know, yeah. We were doing [ __ ] together. >> One of those old pictures that I sent you, Chad and Haley, it was Dad and Haley standing with their trophies together. Yeah, that was a [clears throat] funny ass picture. >> Yeah, like yeah, he was heavily involved in our sports careers and uh he co ...
... ll out there just like going back and forth. I go, "What is going on here?" And you guys were going at it with politics. Yeah. Well, that became kind of the mode anytime Haley and I would come back. We'd come in, sit on the couch in the living room silently, and just wait for dad to erupt yelling at us about whatever the the thing was that wee ...
... We'd come in, sit on the couch in the living room silently, and just wait for dad to erupt yelling at us about whatever the the thing was that week. >> I don't remember Haley ever chiming in and being like yelling back on politics so until now. Really? Until the podcast. Yeah. I I wasn't I didn't care about politics until I think I had kids. ...
... cerbated, obviously, the the role politics plays in our family, obviously, because we're on opposite sides of it. But I also think there's a piece of this that is me and Haley becoming adults. And that this like some version of this disagreement about lifestyle or what we're doing with our lives was going to happen regardless. Yeah. I think it ...
... om, you were, too. To like allow that part of all of our lives collectively to move on. Personally, this is my own personal belief. I think you guys had a hard time when Haley and I left, went to college, and started to become adults and are like leading our own lives and stuff. Um and I think that is a little bit of a part of it that like all ...
... left, went to college, and started to become adults and are like leading our own lives and stuff. Um and I think that is a little bit of a part of it that like allowing Haley and I to have adult opinions about anything, politics is is one of those things, but I think it's difficult for you because it means on some small level the death of tha ...
... You haven't. You haven't. Let's see. We can go back on like the last episode. Maybe you Well, how about this? How about this, Mary Lou? How about this? I'm proud of you, Haley. Your father and I are very proud of you. And your dad will say the same thing. When he talks to you about adult people. >> I just I go back to when I told you I wanted ...
... g to end up bankrupt and living with you. You did not encourage me to follow that dream. You in fact told me I was going to fail. You want Are you denying it? >> to you. Haley, take it the next step. Say how did that make you feel? I mean, I'll be honest. I I feel like uh I don't I don't know that it did hurt. I mean, I I feel like from a very ...
... nd this is something you made up. I never asked you for [ __ ] You asked us for 80 I won't say the amount. I never asked you for [ __ ] You are literally gaslighting me. Haley, you asked us for money. You are lying! Okay, hold on. Hold on. Time out. Time out. Hold on. Hold on. My turn. Let me talk. Let me talk. Let me talk. Okay. It's easy to ...
... ed for her that you're disappointed in her and that you're not proud of her. And that's the most important thing about this about this last couple minutes. I'm so sorry, Haley, if you feel that way. I apologize. We never have made you want to feel that way. Now, I have always said until the day I die, but now I backtracked and taken that away. ...
... 'm sorry you felt that way. All I wanted for both of you is to be happy and I hope you are and I'm proud of both of you. Thank you. Well, just let that sit Take that in, Haley. Take that in. Mhm. Yeah, take in that both of you got your college education paid for. By who? Us. It doesn't have anything to do with money, Bob. >> No, but it has to ...
... amn school on the planet Uh-huh. and didn't say a word. I I I'm not I'm sitting here listening. I don't know why you're coming at for me. Bob, Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Haley, you got same deal. We gave you where you wanted to go to school and we paid for it. Mhm. So, Bob, let me I I understand. Hold on. Um Bob, it sounds like you feel offend ...
... tand. Hold on. Um Bob, it sounds like you feel offended by what they're saying. Yeah. I'm sorry, Chad. I don't mean to loop you into this, but I what Haley's saying that Haley you're offended that Haley is saying that she her experience was that you kind of had a predetermined route for her because you don't >> had things I wanted her to do, b ...
... ounds like you feel offended by what they're saying. Yeah. I'm sorry, Chad. I don't mean to loop you into this, but I what Haley's saying that Haley you're offended that Haley is saying that she her experience was that you kind of had a predetermined route for her because you don't >> had things I wanted her to do, but she chose not to do them ...
... pporting us through a financial lens. And of course, we are extremely Listen, just listen. We are >> to work my ass off for the financial end. I understand. You know how Haley complains about 13-hour days? Well, strap on 24 hours a day. That's what I did for many, many years. It's always a competition with you. I know. I mean, I get up in the ...
... as going to say was anytime this type of conversation ever starts to be approached, uh Mom and Dad, you both always immediately go to the financial angle. And of course, Haley and I are very grateful that you helped us go through college and all the [ __ ] that you've given us throughout our lives. Of course, we I think both of us feel like we ...
... out of a hole and became multi-millionaires. We did that. Okay, I understand. And And what I'm saying is you always go to this financial thing as though because of that Haley and I can't feel any type way about the actual emotional treatment or lack of support. And I can give you a million examples, but I'll just say broadly, yes, you helped ...
... 't say these things. And I know you did, and I have a husband who was there who knows you did, and it makes me angry. Because you [ __ ] deny truths. In regards to what, Haley? You continuously this is like some made-up [ __ ] in your head that I asked you for money to open my bakery. That is a [ __ ] lie. Why We leveraged our home and our 401 ...
... I I think Haley's always blamed me for something, always. She's never been happy and I think she has always blamed me and Bob for her not being happy. Is that not right, Haley? I am happy. I do everything that I want in life. I don't understand. >> There's a little bit of resentment though about like what you're talking about right now, that y ...
... u I just want to I can see you're really struggling with this and so I just want to take a minute to to kind of like you know, give you a minute. You're deeply hurt that Haley is saying that. Okay, because you remember being affectionate with your kids, being loving with them, hugging them, being there for them emotionally. Yep. And and for Ha ...
... ey is saying that. Okay, because you remember being affectionate with your kids, being loving with them, hugging them, being there for them emotionally. Yep. And and for Haley to be saying that you know, like you said, she's probably not lying, she's probably remembering differently. Um but that's really wounding to you because as we've talked ...
... being told you know, you weren't a good enough mom. That's right. Okay. Okay. I Mom, I want you to know if if I may. >> Sometimes I think thinking back I gave too much. Haley, um I want a pair of Doc Martens. Okay, here's one pair. Oh, I need another color. Okay, here's another one. I need another one. How many did you end up getting Haley? I ...
... h. Haley, um I want a pair of Doc Martens. Okay, here's one pair. Oh, I need another color. Okay, here's another one. I need another one. How many did you end up getting Haley? I gave too much sometimes. Hm. 60 pairs of Doc Martens, is that what you had? I don't know. So But you're again talking about material things and money. >> Right. >> Ye ...
... ou had? I don't know. So But you're again talking about material things and money. >> Right. >> Yeah. Right. Yeah. I gave too much. >> So Mary Lou, when you're when when Haley was sad or came home from a game that she didn't perform well in or something, were you there for her? Yes, I feel like I was. Okay. >> there when she got dumped by a bo ...
... theory out there that I might be off on, but sometimes we judge our parents by the standards that we have today. Um in my household growing up, I'm a bit older than you, Haley. But, you know, stoicism was a very big deal. You know, don't cry, keep a stiff upper lip. Um the way that I raised my children is very different from the way that I was ...
... at's why I'm trying to give this is why we don't ever talk about it. Give me a chance here. So, that's why I'm trying to offer this perspective. Because it, you know, if Haley can maybe see your perspective a little bit and have an understanding of generationally how we have evolved as parents. Um maybe she will be a little bit more graceful a ...
... that you're defensive. We love you. We love both of you guys. That's why we're doing this podcast. That's why we're having this conversation so that these things Sorry, Haley, go ahead. There was a question. I think maybe you asked that the last time we had you on, like what would you have done different as parents and you said absolutely not ...
... parenting, you know. There may be a couple of wrongs we can all agree on. You shouldn't kill your children or whatever, but um I think you were doing the best you could. Haley and I turned out great. We're both happy, leading healthy lives. Yeah, there's some bumps, but like everybody has that. You're telling me you guys don't have [ __ ] from ...
... gry when like we bring it up and I feel like you make me feel like I'm insane because you gaslight me. You literally just lie about [ __ ] and I don't understand that. I Haley, and I'm not trying to put you on this spot here too much, but um do you think they're lying or do you think they remember it differently? Hard to say. Uh maybe they I d ...
... ice as fathers tend to do and mothers tend to do, too. And Mary Lou, maybe you either overheard part of that and took from it that the conversation had been initiated by Haley asking for money. I mean, it's really hard to see how a misunderstanding like that could have occurred. But I don't think, Mary Lou, you're just making it up out of nowh ...
... money. I mean, it's really hard to see how a misunderstanding like that could have occurred. But I don't think, Mary Lou, you're just making it up out of nowhere to make Haley look bad. No. Um but it's also important that when Haley is saying that's not true, it didn't happen, that you can believe her. I'm thinking back in my mind right now, I ...
... ding like that could have occurred. But I don't think, Mary Lou, you're just making it up out of nowhere to make Haley look bad. No. Um but it's also important that when Haley is saying that's not true, it didn't happen, that you can believe her. I'm thinking back in my mind right now, I see her sitting on this couch right over here. I want my ...
... what one thing we know for sure about our memories is they are not very good. They're not accurate at all. Okay, so it's okay to say I remember you asking for money. And Haley for you to say I remember and I have knowledge that I absolutely didn't. And then you can choose to believe each other. You can choose to one of you can choose to believ ...
... art of the necessary conversation is talking about this stuff. And I know it's not easy. I know you don't like hearing these things. But we're also not like like look at Haley and I. We're fully adults. We this is not anything that we're talking about that affects our lives on a day-to-day basis, obviously. But we just want to be able to have ...
... I could. And some of it wasn't helpful to my kids, right? So, I just want to make sure that that's >> I'm okay. >> Yeah, okay. Yeah, and Bob, I want you to be okay. And Haley and Chad, I don't want you guys to feel like I'm glossing over because I think having these conversations and coming to a repair where you, you know, where um you know, ...
... nd Tik Tok if you want to see some wild [ __ ] about what Donald Trump is sending his supporters in emails. Um absolutely fantastic work that you do there and thank you, Haley, for joining us. Thank you all for joining us. As always, before we go, Haley, I love you. Thank you for doing this. Mom and Dad, I do love you very much and I thank you ...
... ing his supporters in emails. Um absolutely fantastic work that you do there and thank you, Haley, for joining us. Thank you all for joining us. As always, before we go, Haley, I love you. Thank you for doing this. Mom and Dad, I do love you very much and I thank you for showing up to this. I know this is not easy to have these conversations, ...